[Namssorg]

Anyone spot any?

While there are clearly a couple of spots where you can tell scenes were abbreviated, modified, inserted, etc. I felt like this movie did really well with congruity, despite the complexities of everything going on.

One slip I did notice was just before Phoebe and Podcast go out on the call to the Melody Diner. If you look in the locker where Phoebe grabs her pack, the Police notice paper that's hanging up on the doors and walls later in the film is already hung up behind the pack. Something you'd never notice on first viewing, but on the second it did take me out of the movie for just a second.

[mrmichaelt]

I think they got some timeline line stuff wrong. I think IRL it was because of the date delay and forgot to correct some lines of dialogue. Like at least one they refer to Afterlife being 2 years ago. It has to be 3. In Afterlife, it was cemented to be in June 2021 and Trevor admits he's 15 and will be 16 in February the next year. So FE, can't be in June/July 2023. It has to be June/July 2024, as Trevor states he's 18. Then that error creates some minor doubt what other things like when Winston I think said he gave them the business/Firehouse last year. The press for the Back in Town comic stated it takes place mid-way between the movies go going by it being a 3 year skip, the comic is 1.5 years after Afterlife which would be December 2022 but with some wiggle room, January 2023 to make Winston's statement work.

[mardin_chatzuk]

One big incongruity: the possessed lion statue Phoebe destroys is Patience (correctly identified by Podcast in the earlier scene when they arrive at the library), but Winston later asks "Then why did you shoot Fortitude in the face?"

Another one in the final scene in front of the firehouse: when the Spenglers are standing together in front of the building when Slimer and the Sewer Dragon fly out, Trevor is standing in a different place in the differently positioned shots we cut between. In the shot with the firehouse behind them, he's with the others, but in the shot looking the other direction, he's standing some distance away, farther into the street.

[Nadrarak]

The lion is actually something I don't mind, it could also be Winston making that mistake instead of a mistake by the filmmakers.

Maybe even as a setup for a smart-ass reply from Phoebe that got cut ("I didn't. I shot Patience in the face.")

[The_Stuntman]

The biggest glaring issue was when they cut a section of the firepole (to melt and coat pack part). Not long after that, two clear shots (One slo-mo *Firemaster*) of them sliding down and the entire pole is in place.

Also, thought I was losing my mind the first time I saw it. But towards the end of Patton Oswalts speech he says something talking about how they are "Real bad guys" (or something along those lines). The Audio is much different at that point and his mouth movements are no where close to the line. Hopefully someone else noticed that. Which leads me to wonder what he originally said, why they voiced that line over and why it didn't match.

[tylergfoster]

The biggest glaring issue was when they cut a section of the firepole (to melt and coat pack part). Not long after that, two clear shots (One slo-mo *Firemaster*) of them sliding down and the entire pole is in place.

This was discussed a bit in one of the other threads, I guess there are three poles in the firehouse, and the one that was cut is in the upper floors, ending in the kitchen. Definitely something that is not as clear as it could be in the movie.

[jonogunn]

this one bugged me since Afterlife.

It was established in GB1 & 2 that after they draw their wands that it's too difficult to reholster on the vhook so they just sling it on their belts afterwards.

In afterlife it bugged me that after the gozer fight they had their wands back on the packs.

In frozen empire when they run downstairs to switch on the containment unit they had their wands holstered, then right after the battle was won you see them back on the pain floor with all the wands slung off their belt.

[mrmichaelt]

The scream when Sewer Dragon charges towards Ecto-1 bugs me.

[Denike]

Something has been bugging me and I’m hoping it’s just me misunderstanding what I heard.

After Lucky shoots Garraka and discovers the proton packs won’t work against him, James Acaster’s character explains that it might be because Garraka has different atomic structure than the ghosts.

So if the proton packs and the traps work on the same principal and frequencies, how would the containment unit be able to hold Garraka?

[zeta otaku]

Something has been bugging me and I’m hoping it’s just me misunderstanding what I heard.

After Lucky shoots Garraka and discovers the proton packs won’t work against him, James Acaster’s character explains that it might be because Garraka has different atomic structure than the ghosts.

So if the proton packs and the traps work on the same principal and frequencies, how would the containment unit be able to hold Garraka?

My take away:

the packs and traps (and thus the ECU) are two different technologies. While the packs may have been ineffective without the brass/copper modification Phoebe did, the trap tech, for whatever reason, wasn't limited to that restriction... OR it just so happens the traps and ECU already had those metals as part of their make up just to function.

[mrmichaelt]

Hmm, I presumed it was the same idea that almost 200 traps could capture Gozer, the Terror Dogs, and his P.K.E. maelstrom. The ECU was likened to a giant ghost trap earlier in the movie, so it probably has the power of hundreds of traps or comparable to the power of the orb.

[Denike]

I would be inclined to agree with you, except for the fact that the proton packs were shown to be more or less effective against Gozer (if you’ve got four anyway). They made a point to show that they didn’t work on Garraka.

I was under the impression that the readings taken by Egon in the first movie was the basis for their technology. So if one thing doesn’t work, neither should the other.

I don’t know. I’m not looking to argue, I’m just puzzled.

[Denike]

(Willing to concede that he might’ve been weakened by Phoebe’s brass-altered proton stream)

[tylergfoster]

Longform post about the many adjustments I'd make to Frozen Empire. I don't know if I would call them "errors" but they are incongruities, either with the series or within the film's own structure.

• As mentioned in the talkback thread, I think the opening should be reframed with a bit before the sewer dragon bust. Phoebe, Callie, Gary, and Trevor are still getting settled in the firehouse. There have been no ghosts busted between Afterlife and Frozen Empire. Winston has told them he has a surprise for them but he's waiting for them to be fully at home in the firehouse first. They get an unexpected call, and Gary convinces them to go. The sewer dragon bust is their first return to action, and that is when Peck realizes he has to call them in.

• I have to agree with whoever noted in the news or talkback thread (I can't remember which) that this movie totally handwaved the "there hasn't been a ghost sighting in 30 years" bit that Afterlife introduced. Ghosts have always been cyclical in the 1984 Ghostbusters movies (putting the quality of the movie as a whole aside, I liked the idea from the 2016 film that the villain created a device that basically attracts ghosts, because that provides an explanation for the specific outbreak in the movie), and this movie could have taken the opportunity to canonize that a little with a brief, one-or-two-line research explanation from Ray or Winston.

• I never doubted that Ghostbusters II was canon, but it is a little hard to swallow that the Statue of Liberty walk happened and that belief is not more clearly split between believers and non-believers. This is something that could've been fixed in Afterlife by framing Phoebe's lack of belief in ghosts as a personal viewpoint. That also leads into my next complaint, which is that the ice storm that hits the city at the end of this one is practically forgotten before the movie is over rather than by a subsequent movie 32 years later. Kind of wish Peck had shown up with a team of weathermen at the end trying to debunk it as some kind of flash-freeze phenomenon.

• I definitely wish that the Trevor subplot about being an adult had been a bit better developed, as Trevor remains the least-interesting character for me. I agree with those who said that Callie lets him drive the ECTO-1 at the end for almost no reason.

• Extend the conversation of Ray and Phoebe talking about what it would be like to be a ghost so that it has an ending. Distort Podcast's recording of the chant a little more so that the one on the library recording is the only clean and complete version.

• Restore the scene where Lucky and Phoebe find some way to escape the PRC, as this is totally inexplicable in the finished film. (I'd also be very interested to see whatever Venkman's other material at the PRC was, as it would be nice if his scene there with Nadeem had a beginning or an ending.)

• The part where Phoebe covers her pack in copper should've been executed a bit differently. It may not necessarily make sense for them to want to keep her benched in that moment, but if they did do that before Garakka freezes everyone, then her triumph coming up with the idea to bronze the pack and then saving the day with it would feel more like a payoff to that thread, where she is a necessary part of the team who solves the day with her wit and intellect. My alteration would be that Lars shows up with the upgraded packs, but there isn't one for Phoebe. Gary, as part of his "becoming a parent" thread, would tell Phoebe to sit this one out because he's worried that she could get hurt. They could also do a joke here where she finds out about the speech he made when she wasn't home: "I had a whole speech, and it was really nice, and then it turned out you weren't here, but the gist is, I care about you, and if anything happened to you, I'd never forgive myself." She tries to tell him about the problem with the pack, as she observed Lucky's issue in the PRC, but Garakka arrives and he has to go into battle even though he knows it might fail. There is an explicit acknowledgement that the pack upgrades do something but don't help enough to stop Garakka and everyone gets frozen. Phoebe then retrieves the pack she stashed under her bed to do the copper upgrade, and saves the day.

[mrmichaelt]

I definitely wish that the Trevor subplot about being an adult had been a bit better developed, as Trevor remains the least-interesting character for me. I agree with those who said that Callie lets him drive the ECTO-1 at the end for almost no reason.

Could have sworn there were 1 or 2 times Trevor offered to drive/asked for the keys but was ignored. But in a related note, what's up with him and Lucky. He get friendzoned?

[Boston Ghostbusters]

The biggest glaring issue was when they cut a section of the firepole (to melt and coat pack part). Not long after that, two clear shots (One slo-mo *Firemaster*) of them sliding down and the entire pole is in place.

Also, thought I was losing my mind the first time I saw it. But towards the end of Patton Oswalts speech he says something talking about how they are "Real bad guys" (or something along those lines). The Audio is much different at that point and his mouth movements are no where close to the line. Hopefully someone else noticed that. Which leads me to wonder what he originally said, why they voiced that line over and why it didn't match.

I just re-checked it. There are at least 3 fire poles in the firehouse and Phoebe was sawing the pole near her room. Sorry to “Well, Actually…” this.

[Boston Ghostbusters]

About to do my fifth screening after my fourth. Found a lot of answers to problems I had with it.

[ShandorMiningCo]

So if the proton packs and the traps work on the same principal and frequencies, how would the containment unit be able to hold Garraka?

It's a weird one but I'm going to pretend the packs and traps work in two different ways.

When Winston is introducing the Spenglers to the PRC he states that the proton fields on the enclosures use "the same technology that's in your packs" but he doesn't say traps, which to me would have made more sense given they're trying to contain a ghost (and the fact that the proton field design borrows elements from the trap rather than the packs - red cylinders, hazard stripes, etc). I might be reading too much into a simple throwaway line of dialogue but it feels like they are two separate mechanics, so I'll give them a pass on trapping Garraka.

Also his horns were ripped off while he was being sucked into the ECU and Wartzki says earlier that these are the source of his power, which is probably why the firemasters were able to trap him originally after he lost them the first time. I'm assuming without those, combined with the weakening effect of brass, he's pretty susceptible to conventional trapping.

One thing I didn't like was how the ECU magically plugged itself even though Garraka pretty much tore it wide open. I know Ray "explains" this but doesn't really delve into how.

[mrmichaelt]

One thing I didn't like was how the ECU magically plugged itself even though Garraka pretty much tore it wide open. I know Ray "explains" this but doesn't really delve into how.

He didn't physically attack the unit, it was his mental powers. Garraka used his mental powers to compel the ghosts to break out. Once he was forced into the unit and his power was neutralized, his hold on the unit pipe keeping it open was no more and the ECU went back to normal? Kind of like think of the tear in the unit pipe as a portal he opens, and once he's trapped in the ECU and his powers are neutralized, the portal closes. Shrug.

[ShandorMiningCo]

He didn't physically attack the unit, it was his mental powers. Garraka used his mental powers to compel the ghosts to break out. Once he was forced into the unit and his power was neutralized, his hold on the unit pipe keeping it open was no more and the ECU went back to normal? Kind of like think of the tear in the unit pipe as a portal he opens, and once he's trapped in the ECU and his powers are neutralized, the portal closes. Shrug.

Fair enough, I can dig it.

[mrmichaelt]

Fair enough, I can dig it.

Yeah, I get it. Rationalizing that is a bit of a thinker.

[fusi0n]

[RiverofSlime]

The biggest glaring issue was when they cut a section of the firepole (to melt and coat pack part). Not long after that, two clear shots (One slo-mo *Firemaster*) of them sliding down and the entire pole is in place.

This was discussed a bit in one of the other threads, I guess there are three poles in the firehouse, and the one that was cut is in the upper floors, ending in the kitchen. Definitely something that is not as clear as it could be in the movie.

I was really confused by this in the movie.

[tylergfoster]

One other thing I forgot on my list post that another user brought up is Janine's joke about how they weren't thinking about the future in the '80s re: the containment unit. Since Egon explicitly talks about how "it's getting crowded in there" in the first movie, I definitely would've had an alternate explanation that they upgraded it after it blew up the first time, and then they upgraded it again in the '90s before Egon bailed, but the upgrade process is tricky, and that would be another reason for Winston to have paid for the new one in the PRC.

[One time]

1. If the containment unit was emptied and all ghosts set free, where is Gozer?

2. If the Manhattan society freed Garraka in 1908 using the encantation how did Garraka end up back in the orb?

[Kingpin]

1. If the containment unit was emptied and all ghosts set free, where is Gozer?

Somewhere else, because Gozer was never in the Firehouse Containment Unit?

2. If the Manhattan society freed Garraka in 1908 using the encantation how did Garraka end up back in the orb?

Perhaps an audio recording isn't enough to fully release Garraka? It has to be a living person reciting the incantation.

1) The 1904 and 2024 exteriors of the Firehouse depict two out of the three street-level windows still as windows, rather than as blocked-up recesses, whilst these windows weren't built into the interior set due to costing reasons.



2) The metal support arms for hanging a banner on the side of Hook & Ladder №8, which were added after the building was restored in 2018, are visible on the 1904 version of the exterior.

3) The exterior of the Paranormal Research Center has the word "POOL" visible on its exterior, even though in-universe the structure is depicted as a disused aquarium.

[ShandorMiningCo]

2. If the Manhattan society freed Garraka in 1908 using the encantation how did Garraka end up back in the orb?

This is just assumption on my part but I'm guessing the recorded incantation opened the orb enough for Garraka to lash out with the death chill before realising that he still couldn't actually escape. After learning this (and pondering on it for another hundred years) he came to the correct conclusion that a living human voice is needed to speak the chant to open the orb fully, not an artificial recording.

3) The exterior of the Paranormal Research Center has the word "POOL" visible on its exterior, even though in-universe the structure is depicted as a disused aquarium.

I'll give them a pass on this (at a stretch) if the aquarium also included a mini waterpark perhaps? Not that I've ever heard of an IRL aquarium having this facility, but if I can believe the NY library replaced a lion statue in less than two days, anything is possible.

[zeta otaku]

3) The exterior of the Paranormal Research Center has the word "POOL" visible on its exterior, even though in-universe the structure is depicted as a disused aquarium.

Two things I can think of:

1) Prior to the aquarium, it may have been a public pool and they never took down the signage?

2) It may just be the part of the label for that section of the building... and they never took down the signage. Like "Penguin Pool" or "Dolphin Pool" or ANYTHING like that?

[Brothertutbar]

Podcast suits up in his old suit and by the time he hammered the pack in the fire house he has a new suit with a real name tag, you see it more at the end when the girl takes a selfie with him

[mrmichaelt]

2. If the Manhattan society freed Garraka in 1908 using the encantation how did Garraka end up back in the orb?

This is just assumption on my part but I'm guessing the recorded incantation opened the orb enough for Garraka to lash out with the death chill before realising that he still couldn't actually escape. After learning this (and pondering on it for another hundred years) he came to the correct conclusion that a living human voice is needed to speak the chant to open the orb fully, not an artificial recording.

Plus, we can presume the Fire Master came in time to reseal the orb.